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This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 22:14:37

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Hello, dear listener, and welcome back to Maximum Power, the only Blake 7 podcast who knows it's not a good weekend unless you're getting smashed right in the asteroid.

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I'm Brendan.

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Conrad.

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I'm James And I'm Mark.

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Well, Avon's disastrous decision to dance with a space rock leads everyone to tell him, I told you so, before heading to Casper, the friendly space planet, home to a gang of space bikers and their scientific space advisor, Dr. Paxton, the one previous careful owner of the Star Drive.

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Now, Conrad, as this is your 1st time joining us, Would you mind giving us and the listener at home, a quick crash course in your experience of Blake 7?

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Just bearing in mind that Mark has not seen the rest of the series from this point.

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That's fine.

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I won't talk about the big song and dance number at the end where Stephen Pacey finally does sing the theme tune.

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So I was 7 years old. when Blake's haven't started and I watched every single episode until right until the end of it.

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And I think I've probably watched the series over the years.

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Like once a decade, I'll watch the whole thing through.

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So, you know, I'm probably on my 4th or 5th, you know, rewatch. and that's as far as it goes.

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I have very, I was very excited about the Blue Peter teleport bracelets and bracelet make, but not quite enough to actually make the thing that had a friend at school that was mad about it.

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I remember he had the magazines and had posters on his walls that I was very fascinated by.

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But that's it, apart from a couple of, a couple of, I did meet and work with a couple of the cast members later on, but yeah, I'm, so I'm a, I'm a fan, but not a, not a Doctor Who fan, but uh, sort of level fan.

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But when I think it was during lockdown when we used to have a little Zoom group, Colin Neil 1st suggested doing, oh, we should do a Blake 7 podcast, and I don't know why.

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But the 1st thing I said is, oh, I'll do the space rats.

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So presumably that that was an image that had stuck into my 10 year old brain.

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So it was the 1st thing I said, so that's why I'm here.

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Right.

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Fantastic.

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So this is the episode with the space rats, but before we get to them, we start with a very tense scene aboard Scorpio.

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And for me, this is a big highlight of the episode.

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It's kind of set up as, you know, this is the 1st time that all 5 of them are sort of working in simpatico since Sulin kind of threw a lot in with them at the end of episode two.

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Mark, what do you think of this scene?

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Yeah, I really liked it.

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I do like episodes where all the crew are involved, you know, which is I liked last weeks.

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There was some of the crews left on the ship and kind of not as involved.

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So yeah, I like it when they're all together.

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I did worry a little bit once the ship had hit the asteroid and it was damaged and there was no power.

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I was a bit worried it was going to be a bottle episode because I'm not really very excited about bottle episodes of TV shows and I thought it was going to be them sort of drifting for an hour, working together to solve various problems and avoid federation patrol ships and that kind of thing.

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So I was quite pleased when that was resolved relatively quickly.

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In a way, it is a bottle episode.

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Because Villa at least pretends to hit the bottle. to get out of repairing the ship.

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Yeah, I think I think it's something Michael Keating sort of says about the character is that, you know, a lot of people are remembering this, being a drunk, but at least half the time when he's being a drunk, he's not actually drunk, and it is just this ploy of, I want people to underestimate me.

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And yeah, I was reading a reference book for this episode and it's like, oh yeah, and Villa's drunk because it's the 4th season.

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So of course he's drunk. but he's not actually.

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No.

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And that was very clever.

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It was a very clever.

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It caught me out, it caught us all out, and it's it's terribly funny, and there's the, you know, there's a lot of tension, but there's a lot of energy, and it was, I was very impressed with how funny this episode was.

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I mean, I loved the bit where Avon is just like, initiate the backup system and slave is like, I'm very sorry about this, but that was the backup system.

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It's really funny.

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There was lots of zingers.

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It was terribly funny.

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Everybody has a lot of great business in this episode.

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Villa, like, for example, has some fabulous kind of weaselies, sort of villa moments, and also all that sort of villas, sort of cowardice, but, you know, it's based in experience.

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Like he's experienced what the space rats are like.

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And he's, you know, like he's, he's tried to say, no, we shouldn't go there.

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These guys are maniacs, but also it's, it's kind of delivered in that sort of fabulous Michael Keating kind of, he's not quite serious about what he's saying.

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It's kind of like rye and tongue in cheek.

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It's, it's really, um, it's really quite enjoyable to watch.

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A bit of an indictment.

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I thought, the time that it was made that when he's trying to sell to his crewmates that he's drunk, the 1st thing he does is sleaze on one of the female characters.

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He does that.

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He goes to that 1st before he then, you know, starts to start to talk about the other stuff, which suppose he's more of a 70s, maybe affectation of a drunk character.

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But then they forgive him.

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When it turns out he's not drunk, he was just being sleazy for effect to trick Avon and Tarrant into going and repairing the preparing the hole in the hole.

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As soon as he's sort of like, no, I was just drinking water, they're like, oh, yay.

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And they just let him get away with it.

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They don't call him out on it.

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They don't take the piss out of him.

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They just like, actually yeah, we'll pay that.

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It's such a, it's such a good episode for him and like he's, he's really on absolute, amazing form.

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He's so funny.

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Like, it does, it takes a lot for me to actually laugh out loud at something, but he did actually make me laugh out loud, as you say, James Wiz.

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He was describing, you know, the danger on the planet and he's that joke.

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You know, all they live for is sex and violence, booze and speed.

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And the fellows are just as bad.

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And I just laughed out loud.

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A little bit of a gated joke, but that is a perfectly constructed and perfectly executed joke.

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And also, when we later on get down and see the space rats, there are women, you know, very, very often in Blake 7, it's like, we'll get, we'll get to a planet and they're men, men, men, men, men, and maybe a woman.

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And if it's Ben Steed, someone hits them in the face, you know.

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And tells them that they are, you know, they're a woman.

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They should know their place.

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Okay.

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Power's gone now he can't hurt us anymore.

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I'm on power.

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Oh, you were.

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You were.

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Now, something I particularly love about that scene is I think it's very, very cleverly shot.

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We've got David Sullivan Proudfoot directing.

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He directs 3 episodes this season, so he directed Traitor last week.

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And he's directing Star Drive now, and I think he really knows how to get the best out of this flight deck set.

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It's very long and narrow, and he shoots it from the side and sort of Darrow is between the consoles, giving the orders and what have you.

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And then when everything goes wrong, and Dana, Villa, and Tarrant are all saying to him, I told you so, they all sort of pass him.

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It's very theatrical and very Shakespearean, and they turn the lights down to sell this problem.

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Uh, yeah, I think the studio bits on Scorpio are incredibly well directed in this episode.

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It's the 1st time we see the front viewscreen, if not the real one as well.

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So you get more of a sense of what the space is like and what they're looking at when they're flying and manipulating the controls and things like that.

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Yeah, I've got a problem with this set hugely.

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I think with the liberator is obviously such a beautiful design, you know, outside and inside.

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It's very distinctive, but it's also very 70s.

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So I can see why they want to update it and this is very, very 80s.

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Um, the models, like uh, Ron Thornton's model work is just amazing.

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I think everybody would agree that the, the, just the way they shoot it, the actual models themselves, the Xenon base, it's all absolutely beautiful, but the interior, and I'm, you know, I'm sure maybe people have picked up on this in the 1st episode, but the interior is just very, It's it's just very flat.

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There's no levels to it.

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There's no depth to it.

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There is no colour to it.

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There's no detail to it. very blank.

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You know, they are frequently in shots.

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They're just like just lots of blank boring spaces.

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At one point, Avon turns away to kind of brood on his own.

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And it's a bit ridiculous because he's brooding to completely blank wall.

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It is very of the time, that colour scheme of gray and yellow.

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I remember that in the 80s in clothes and design.

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And I understand it was, it was designed to sort of make it easier to direct.

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And I'm like, well, yeah, David does really kind of bring it to life.

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But also I don't think it's doing what they want it to do because in the descriptions of it.

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Villoromos said that it would like post-alien, they want to make it darker, more cramped, obsolete and functional.

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I'm like it's functional, but it's none of those other things at all.

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It looks like a radiator show room.

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Terribly unexciting.

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It's not quite flat.

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It's corrugated.

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There was a building when I was at Sydney University, there's a building at the university called the transient building, which was basically, uh, corrugated fibre board, maybe, or fibreglass, sorry, that reminds me.

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It was this sort of gray gray building.

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It was built in the, I believe in the 1950s.

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It was still there when I was at university in the 1990s.

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And it was called the transient building.

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But that always reminded me of the inside of Scorpio.

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It looks like, it looks to me, Scorpio looks like collarbond roof.

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Yeah, yeah.

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But he does direct it well in that, but he has to cheat it in order to get that nice shot of the five.

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They all just have to come back and come forward and stand behind the other people's chairs.

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It's like, come on.

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This isn't framing your main people.

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I mean, this is the design.

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I was like, you know, I just wanted to know who's designed it.

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It's Roger Cann, did it with Mary Ridge, but he also designed Nightmare of Eden from Doctor Who, which was one of my absolute favourite stories, but there is also a flatness. and sort of blankness to us.

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It does feel like a studio.

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Grey and yellow and brownness as well.

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There is, yeah.

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On the direction.

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The other influence maybe Star Wars.

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I noticed there was a Star Wars style wipe transition as the as the ship is coming back into land in the base.

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It goes from top to bottom, which I think I'd never noticed in Blake 7 before, but it felt like it's probably influenced by that as well as, they say, alien and other things.

139
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Well, then so is Scorpio, really.

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I mean, Scorpio looks like it could be some sort of uh, baby star destroyer, painted brown, orange.

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You know, another thing is the lighting of the set.

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When, you know, everything goes wrong, we get the dim lighting.

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We get dim lighting in some other episodes, but it just means it looks like the lighting designer, Warwick Fielding, who handles all bar one episode this season.

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It looks like his default is, you know, the typical BBC default of light the hell out of everything.

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Let no shadow shine.

146
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Yeah, it's it's a bit of a shame.

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But, you know, it is kind of what we're seeing in Doctor Who at the time. when you said Nightmare of Eden, Conrad, I did just have a quick look and no, he doesn't do the lighting of Nightmare of Eden.

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But he does do the lighting on stones of blood, which, of course, has what?

149
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A gray spaceship and power of Kroll, which has what?

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A bolterwood refinery.

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It's also great.

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Ocean gray and military gray.

153
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Moving on from there.

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We do get a nice little bit of lighting for a particularly boring scene where Orex scene of the week is just to say, I'm far too bored with you all to explain what's happening.

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Watch this video that you've shot at 10,000 frames a second, frame by frame, and then maybe we can talk.

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Thoughts.

157
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He does get more and more like his creator.

158
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Yes, as the show goes on, he literally just starts behaving like an irascible old bastard more and more and more.

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I mean, he's a rascal, he's a rascal bastard to start with.

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But at least he actually does his job by by now, he's just like, no, you're stupid.

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I'm not, I don't have time for this.

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Go off.

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Watch this video 10,000 frames a 2nd seems like a lot as well.

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I was looking at like 4 K is 60 frames a second, is that right?

165
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Um, I think the highest frames per 2nd I've worked with on a show.

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I think we shot something and we had to do a special camera for it.

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I think we shot something at 6000 frames a second. for one show, and that was for a Japanese swordmaster slicing a baseball being fired at him from a from a baseball firing machine.

169
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So the idea that Scorpio with its clapped out engine, it's weapons that can't handle any federation ship.

170
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It's just had a teleporter fixed last week.

171
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It's like, yeah, but you know what?

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Dorian, he liked a bit of photography, you know what I mean?

173
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Wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

174
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And yeah, so he's fitted the front of the ship.

175
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Or is it the, actually, is it the back of the ship?

176
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Where they, he's fitted somewhere on the ship?

177
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They're literally looking out of their asses. exploding the ships.

178
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And of course, Avon there does zoom, enhance, zoom, enhance.

179
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I want to see that little thing on his helmet, if you'll pardon the expression.

180
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But I kind of love how they they they undermine that. with, you know, it's like, it'll take hours, and we get a few seconds of Dana looking at it, and then a wipe, and then a few seconds of soon, then looking at it.

181
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Oh, there it is.

182
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I hadn't realised until this episode that they kept Dorian's bass, because they were desperately trying to escape from it in the 1st episode, and then they've never been back or mentioned it, I don't think.

183
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And then they went, although they didn't get out of the ship.

184
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Well, they did to get Aurak, but he didn't get out of the ship.

185
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So I never had any sense that they weren't just living aboard the new ship at all.

186
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Yeah, you did kind of get a sense of that not really being quite clear.

187
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Um, because at the end of power, They basically, you know, like you assume they're going, they're leaving.

188
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They're taking the ship and they're going.

189
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And then in the next episode, there's no mention of the base, really.

190
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And so it's not really clear that this is their base now.

191
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But then, I think that probably ties in with the, the, the way we don't really know how the ship works or how big the ship is or, I mean, does it, does it have bunk beds?

192
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Is there a sleeping quarters, is there?

193
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Or is it just a sort of something that they hoon around in, um, trying to overthrow the Federation?

194
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I think now you say, look, I remember being confused at the time, as in, oh, they've got their new spaceship.

195
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I've got my head around that, but then occasionally they'd pop back somewhere.

196
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So I often kind of got a bit confused about where, where they, what this base is for or where they, where they, where they live exactly.

197
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It was confusing to me at the time and it still is a little bit, to be honest.

198
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I'm still not really sure.

199
00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:02.820
Yeah, I mean, like maybe these episodes were supposed to be in a different order.

200
00:16:02.820 --> 00:16:07.919
Or maybe there was some dialogue that was cut out of some of the other episodes.

201
00:16:07.980 --> 00:16:12.419
In episode one, they are talking about needing a base of operations.

202
00:16:12.480 --> 00:16:19.559
So, um, you know, like it's seeded there, but then in the 2nd episode they're desperately trying to escape it.

203
00:16:20.279 --> 00:16:23.340
Why wouldn't they just always take Aurac with them?

204
00:16:23.399 --> 00:16:25.860
I know he's a pain in the ass, but like he would be useful.

205
00:16:26.220 --> 00:16:28.440
You just really pissed them off.

206
00:16:28.980 --> 00:16:31.200
Fusel to help them.

207
00:16:31.259 --> 00:16:33.299
So they just went, oh, screw you.

208
00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:34.860
We're going to leave you behind on the base.

209
00:16:39.480 --> 00:16:49.980
So we then do find out. that, oh, they must have a star drive, and it must be designed by Dr. Paxton, and, you know, we know who Dr. Paxton is, thanks to Aurak.

210
00:16:50.039 --> 00:17:01.080
But we also get a little bit of world building because Aurak's like, okay, this tells us that the Federation have been rebuilding their shipyards, but they've lost their top designer, which is a funny line as well as being exposition.

211
00:17:01.139 --> 00:17:04.920
But we do now head to the planet Casper to look for Dr. Paxton.

212
00:17:04.980 --> 00:17:10.559
So I would like to talk about Dr. Paxton as played by Barbara Shelley.

213
00:17:10.619 --> 00:17:11.640
What are our thoughts?

214
00:17:11.700 --> 00:17:13.079
Mark, let's start with you.

215
00:17:13.140 --> 00:17:15.180
Yeah, I thought she was very good.

216
00:17:15.240 --> 00:17:20.039
I wasn't familiar with the actor, but having looked her up.

217
00:17:20.099 --> 00:17:26.160
She obviously has an incredible pedigree of kind of vintage and genre TV.

218
00:17:26.640 --> 00:17:28.019
Yes.

219
00:17:28.079 --> 00:17:30.839
She was a she was a screen queen.

220
00:17:30.900 --> 00:17:32.279
Yes, yeah.

221
00:17:32.339 --> 00:17:34.140
So it's a bit like getting Ingrid Pitt.

222
00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:35.400
Yes.

223
00:17:35.460 --> 00:17:41.279
And she's kind of playing it in a similar way, in a way, to in Group Hit in Warriors of the Deep.

224
00:17:41.640 --> 00:17:45.240
So like underplaying it quite a lot.

225
00:17:45.299 --> 00:17:52.500
Yeah, which is probably what you want from this character, but not what you expect from, Barbara Shelley.

226
00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:56.460
It's a good contrast, isn't it, with the space rats?

227
00:17:56.519 --> 00:18:01.259
And, um, she Yeah, she obviously comes across that she's very long suffering.

228
00:18:01.319 --> 00:18:07.140
All she wants to do. is make engines for spaceships and just be left in peace to do it.

229
00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:11.819
And then the space rights are just quite an unusual bunch, aren't they?

230
00:18:11.880 --> 00:18:16.019
that have employer or keep a prisoner or whatever.

231
00:18:16.079 --> 00:18:23.819
Because a couple of things that aren't answered here, and maybe maybe we got onto this, but I think Villa says the space rats are based on an ancient earth cult.

232
00:18:23.880 --> 00:18:37.500
And normally when they say things like that in science fiction, it's something we can relate to in the present day, but I didn't get what they, what they were supposed to be, whether it was like punk rockers or whatever, whatever kind of, I suppose, moral panic was going on.

233
00:18:37.559 --> 00:18:38.400
Hell's Angels.

234
00:18:38.460 --> 00:18:38.940
Yeah.

235
00:18:39.000 --> 00:18:46.500
And then the leader says, as you well know, I'm not a space rat, but then we don't learn what he was.

236
00:18:46.559 --> 00:18:56.160
So I was wondering whether he's supposed to be another person who was part of the Federation and fled it and was kind of in hiding and decided to become a space rat.

237
00:18:56.279 --> 00:19:02.099
It seems to have been lost somewhere in the in the script. editing process.

238
00:19:02.160 --> 00:19:07.319
That's what it doesn't really kind of explain why he's involved who he is.

239
00:19:07.380 --> 00:19:09.779
Because he certainly looks like a space rat.

240
00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:10.619
Yeah.

241
00:19:10.680 --> 00:19:17.460
Also, Dr. Paxton's assistant just disappears between scenes, he just, he's just gone. nobody cares.

242
00:19:17.519 --> 00:19:18.960
She's escaped with the crew.

243
00:19:19.859 --> 00:19:22.440
And he's never mentioned again.

244
00:19:22.500 --> 00:19:28.619
I imagine him getting back from his tea break and everything's just gone to shit and everyone's a big hole in the wall.

245
00:19:28.680 --> 00:19:29.880
The engine's missing.

246
00:19:29.940 --> 00:19:30.960
Everybody's dead.

247
00:19:32.880 --> 00:19:35.460
I was like, they're way 2 minutes.

248
00:19:36.299 --> 00:19:39.359
Heating up this fish in the microwave.

249
00:19:40.380 --> 00:19:55.019
I think just to go back to what you're saying, Mark, about the space rats, because this was something, this was the hook that made my brain just, it was the 1st thing my brain pulled out when you, when they said they were going to do a Blake 7 podcast, I just went space routes, because it was obviously something that stuck in my head.

250
00:19:55.019 --> 00:19:59.759
And actually, when they sort of zoomed in and saw the emblem on, on, on his helmet.

251
00:19:59.819 --> 00:20:01.680
I was just like, and the way they talk about them.

252
00:20:01.740 --> 00:20:05.339
They do give them they do talk, talk them up, a really good game.

253
00:20:05.400 --> 00:20:09.900
So, and I remember as a kid thinking, wow, this lot really are sort of terrifying.

254
00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:13.500
And unlike you, Mark, I was a little bit, it's not immediately obvious.

255
00:20:13.559 --> 00:20:20.700
They said an earth sect of unbelievable viciousness and I was a bit like, um, it, it's got to be the Hell's Angels.

256
00:20:20.819 --> 00:20:23.279
Yeah, I mean, that's the closest thing we've got.

257
00:20:23.339 --> 00:20:34.680
Also, when they mention space chopper, you know, a chopper is that motor, that sort of easy rider motorbike, like, which is, you know, a Harley Davidson, but they look, well, here's the thing.

258
00:20:34.740 --> 00:20:48.480
You sort of say they sort of look like punks with the mohawks and stuff, but it's, they look like a BBC version of punks, which would, this is now, it's now trickled down to the mainstream and now a punk is just a sort of comedy figure.

259
00:20:48.539 --> 00:20:51.299
I think a couple of months after, in fact, a month after this, I think.

260
00:20:51.359 --> 00:21:02.519
Kenny Everett's television show had Gizzard puke, who was a very loveable, uh, you know, easygoing punk that would just come on and tell some jokes and wander off in a sort of that punk wig.

261
00:21:02.579 --> 00:21:06.660
It was a very, it was a sort of comedy character, but they don't actually look like punks.

262
00:21:06.720 --> 00:21:08.759
I was just like, what do they remind me of?

263
00:21:08.819 --> 00:21:14.940
And they reminded me of a band who were coming up the following year, Sieg Sieg Sputnik, who were new wave.

264
00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:25.920
So this is a sort of, It doesn't quite land as anything specific because it sort of Hell's Angels sort of via BBC punk and actually sort of, they look like highlighter pens.

265
00:21:25.980 --> 00:21:27.180
They wear bike leathers.

266
00:21:27.240 --> 00:21:29.339
You can see it under their costumes, but they are just so.

267
00:21:30.299 --> 00:21:33.420
They look more like they should be in Doctor Who than Blake 7 a bit.

268
00:21:33.900 --> 00:21:48.779
And, you know, Mad Max would have happened, you know, so instead you can see in 2000 AD, you can sort of see what they're shooting for, you know, Doctor Who would later do Nord, uh, Vandal of the Roads, you know, a few years later, but then again, that's really, really sort of watered down by that time.

269
00:21:48.839 --> 00:21:54.839
But they, they just suffer from that same problem as they should be sort of young, rough and dirty, how I like them.

270
00:21:54.900 --> 00:21:57.839
But they're, of course, of just, they're just, they're older.

271
00:21:57.900 --> 00:21:58.740
They're clean.

272
00:21:58.799 --> 00:21:59.940
They.

273
00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:06.599
I mean, you know, they sort of chew gum and are a bit cockney, but they're just sort of immaculate and so it doesn't quite realise when they're inside.

274
00:22:06.660 --> 00:22:10.140
But when they're outside, they are very exciting and obviously there's some good action sequences.

275
00:22:10.200 --> 00:22:14.099
But I think that's where, I think that's what they were shooting for and I think that's where we ended up.

276
00:22:14.220 --> 00:22:15.539
Hmm.

277
00:22:15.539 --> 00:22:27.960
I just have to wonder if maybe like one of writer Jim Follett's neighbours had got a motorcycle and it was really loud and he was just really, really annoyed with this sort of thing.

278
00:22:28.019 --> 00:22:35.039
So he's doing, right, my neighbours are hell's angel, and you know, his neighbour's like a retired teacher from Kettering or something who's just decided, I'm retired.

279
00:22:35.099 --> 00:22:35.880
I want my bike now.

280
00:22:35.940 --> 00:22:44.400
It also doesn't like because Hail's Angels in the US were known as a sort of, you know, a sort of quite a criminal organisation.

281
00:22:44.460 --> 00:22:46.440
But actually in the UK.

282
00:22:47.160 --> 00:22:56.039
You know, occasionally every village had like occasionally some Hell's Angels thing would, and they were sort of, they, they were just men who tinkered with their bikes and like real ale.

283
00:22:56.099 --> 00:22:59.579
You know, they were just like, it's like seeing the salvation army or an Avon lady.

284
00:22:59.640 --> 00:23:02.819
They were just sort of... they're fairly harmless.

285
00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:04.619
So again, it doesn't have that punch here.

286
00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:14.519
I suppose the other thing we've had in Doctor Who, in terms of being flamboyantly dressed and enjoying speed and different vehicles and a bit of violence is pert we.

287
00:23:14.579 --> 00:23:18.900
So maybe there's some sort of inspiration there.

288
00:23:19.740 --> 00:23:26.400
And they share a similar taste for the same vehicle, which I've learned isn't a quad bike.

289
00:23:26.460 --> 00:23:28.200
It's an 80 be an all-terrain vehicle.

290
00:23:28.259 --> 00:23:29.460
Oh, there you go.

291
00:23:29.460 --> 00:23:32.700
Three wheel things, which I Googled about 5 minutes before we got on this show.

292
00:23:32.819 --> 00:23:40.859
Well, speaking of, the space buggy that they're driving is actually one of the space buggies from space 1999.

293
00:23:40.980 --> 00:23:42.480
Of course.

294
00:23:43.440 --> 00:23:45.359
An amazing fact.

295
00:23:45.900 --> 00:23:48.180
Was this a buggy they would draw?

296
00:23:48.240 --> 00:23:49.680
I don't know Space 99 is all of it.

297
00:23:49.740 --> 00:23:51.599
It would be one they regularly...

298
00:23:51.660 --> 00:23:51.900
Yeah.

299
00:23:51.900 --> 00:23:58.500
So Barbara Bain may have sat in the exact spot that Barbara Shelley didn't because that's not Barbara Shelley on location.

300
00:23:58.559 --> 00:24:01.799
No, which is...

301
00:24:01.859 --> 00:24:04.019
Which is why they give it the massive cloak.

302
00:24:04.079 --> 00:24:06.779
Look, for the hell of it, let's just say it's Stuart Fell.

303
00:24:06.839 --> 00:24:07.200
Why not?

304
00:24:10.259 --> 00:24:11.279
I wonder why they did that.

305
00:24:11.339 --> 00:24:12.299
Yeah.

306
00:24:12.359 --> 00:24:23.160
It was to avoid paying her a location fee, and that's also why the space rats have helmets so you can have different artists on location compared to with the studio.

307
00:24:26.220 --> 00:24:29.940
I must confess, I did love the space rats lair.

308
00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:34.619
Like it has a pile in the middle, like you would expect rats to have.

309
00:24:34.680 --> 00:24:37.319
It's made of those couches that keep turning up.

310
00:24:37.380 --> 00:24:41.759
However, instead of just putting them against the wall, they've actually gone. put them in the middle of the room.

311
00:24:41.819 --> 00:24:42.839
We put some blankets over them.

312
00:24:42.900 --> 00:24:44.039
We'll make the room look lived in.

313
00:24:44.099 --> 00:24:48.839
I think that's the one thing that's really successful about the space rats.

314
00:24:48.960 --> 00:24:49.500
And Conrad.

315
00:24:49.619 --> 00:24:52.559
I know you're a huge Batman 66 fan.

316
00:24:52.619 --> 00:24:57.480
This feels like a Batman villain lair, just without the camera tilt.

317
00:24:57.720 --> 00:24:58.980
Do you know what?

318
00:24:59.039 --> 00:24:59.700
That's exactly right.

319
00:24:59.819 --> 00:25:01.019
That is exactly right.

320
00:25:01.079 --> 00:25:03.900
And they've, but, and those, those, the trattza sofas.

321
00:25:03.960 --> 00:25:12.240
It was great to see those because you couldn't not have those, but like you said, the way they've arranged it and just covered it in space pillows means that you can get a bit of rough and tumble on them.

322
00:25:12.299 --> 00:25:14.700
So it's quite good. you can do some lounging.

323
00:25:14.759 --> 00:25:16.259
And that was quite exciting.

324
00:25:16.319 --> 00:25:18.539
At one point, I think they looked like they were biting their head off something.

325
00:25:18.599 --> 00:25:19.799
That was quite exciting.

326
00:25:20.099 --> 00:25:21.900
Yeah, they were eating something that looked alike.

327
00:25:21.960 --> 00:25:23.160
That was quite tough.

328
00:25:23.759 --> 00:25:26.759
Aren't those quite expensive sofas?

329
00:25:26.819 --> 00:25:28.140
How did the BBC afford them?

330
00:25:28.200 --> 00:25:32.400
Because they would just keep spray painting them to use them on other productions.

331
00:25:32.460 --> 00:25:37.079
There's only one to use the entire budget of same cars. one year on that sofa.

332
00:25:37.920 --> 00:25:43.619
Caldor, Carfell, you know, you just use these things wherever there's space luxury or decadence.

333
00:25:43.680 --> 00:25:45.119
Yeah, exactly.

334
00:25:45.180 --> 00:25:47.880
Like, it is the same ones every time.

335
00:25:48.059 --> 00:25:52.980
We don't find out what the space rats mean when they say bend them.

336
00:25:55.140 --> 00:25:57.180
Yeah, you're right.

337
00:25:57.240 --> 00:25:58.500
That feels like it's missing.

338
00:25:58.559 --> 00:25:59.519
Yeah.

339
00:25:59.579 --> 00:26:02.940
I just took it to me in a sort of torture.

340
00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:05.460
Like, yeah, bend them till they break.

341
00:26:05.519 --> 00:26:06.420
Yeah, yeah.

342
00:26:06.480 --> 00:26:07.740
No, no, no. nothing sexual.

343
00:26:07.799 --> 00:26:09.119
I was gonna say.

344
00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:11.039
Oh, shame.

345
00:26:11.160 --> 00:26:12.660
Yeah, such...

346
00:26:12.660 --> 00:26:16.319
Calling people gooks just sounds horrifically offensive as well.

347
00:26:16.380 --> 00:26:17.279
Yeah.

348
00:26:17.339 --> 00:26:31.019
Actually, that's, Mark, that, that caught my ear too, because I, I, the 1st time I ever heard that was when I saw Apocalypse now in, you know, university and it's, you know, it's American slang for typically Asian people, but basically anyone who isn't white.

349
00:26:31.079 --> 00:26:42.599
And it comes from the word gobbledygook, as in talking gobbledygook, which came from, I think it comes from, like, an America, US senator a while ago who just used it.

350
00:26:42.660 --> 00:26:45.539
It sounds a bit like a turkey gobble, like gobbledygook.

351
00:26:45.599 --> 00:26:46.559
It just means sort of nonsense.

352
00:26:46.619 --> 00:26:50.160
And then they extrapolated that to mean gook, as in somebody talks differently.

353
00:26:50.220 --> 00:26:54.599
But it is an, it is a racial sort of slur.

354
00:26:54.720 --> 00:26:59.880
I mean, it still is now in use by people as racial slower.

355
00:26:59.940 --> 00:27:04.440
I mean, it's not as common, but it's like...

356
00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:06.720
I mean, how did they think that was appropriate?

357
00:27:07.140 --> 00:27:11.700
And I say, like, they were clearly making a point that these people are racists.

358
00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:16.319
Um, No, it's just, it's just one of those, it's one of those space words.

359
00:27:16.319 --> 00:27:17.700
Like, why not a space word?

360
00:27:17.759 --> 00:27:20.099
Like, a destiny, they don't call them geeks like something.

361
00:27:20.160 --> 00:27:21.000
Like a snoop.

362
00:27:21.180 --> 00:27:29.039
I really sort of see it with the Vietnam War from movies, but maybe, I suppose, in Britain, maybe there hadn't been that many Vietnam war films at that point.

363
00:27:29.099 --> 00:27:33.539
I don't think it hits on English ears as vividly.

364
00:27:33.599 --> 00:27:35.279
It doesn't.

365
00:27:35.279 --> 00:27:38.400
So I think I think to them perhaps it is just a bit more of a vague word.

366
00:27:38.519 --> 00:27:41.940
So it doesn't have that weight here, I don't think.

367
00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:45.720
Yeah, more like kook maybe is what they were aiming for.

368
00:27:45.779 --> 00:28:02.220
Like, but I wanted something spacey, so they added a G, either sort of K. I have to say, I thoroughly enjoyed watching this episode.

369
00:28:03.059 --> 00:28:12.480
I had always remembered it. as much like a lot of series D. as being kind of pants.

370
00:28:12.779 --> 00:28:18.059
Um, you know, like the ship had been destroyed at the end of the last season.

371
00:28:18.119 --> 00:28:24.000
Uh, you know, the set's not great on the new ship.

372
00:28:24.059 --> 00:28:32.220
Um, It all feels a bit like, oh, we cancelled it and then we wanted to renew it for another 13 episodes.

373
00:28:32.279 --> 00:28:35.460
So it had enough episodes for syndication in the US.

374
00:28:35.700 --> 00:28:41.279
And it kind of just felt like maybe they should have stopped it at the end of series C.

375
00:28:41.460 --> 00:28:47.339
But, I actually think there's a lot going for this episode.

376
00:28:47.759 --> 00:28:49.920
It's a bit paddy.

377
00:28:49.980 --> 00:28:56.160
It lacks a B plot, which probably makes it feel a bit loose.

378
00:28:56.220 --> 00:29:06.059
Um, flabby, maybe, like, you know, they're like, they're trying to pad it out because there's not quite enough script, but the ideas in it.

379
00:29:06.119 --> 00:29:07.980
I really quite enjoy.

380
00:29:08.039 --> 00:29:14.220
Uh, like it, it has, it has some interesting ideas, but then, you know, it's, it's a, it's a Jim Follett script.

381
00:29:14.339 --> 00:29:15.839
And Jim Follett.

382
00:29:15.900 --> 00:29:21.059
Whatever you think of his writing, comes up with some really interesting ideas.

383
00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:22.980
Look at Dawn of the Gods.

384
00:29:23.039 --> 00:29:26.700
Look at his own sort of original works.

385
00:29:26.759 --> 00:29:32.039
They are quite interesting, bizarre sci-fi concepts.

386
00:29:32.099 --> 00:29:33.180
Yeah.

387
00:29:33.240 --> 00:29:34.980
This episode is fun.

388
00:29:35.039 --> 00:29:36.480
Like it's really fun.

389
00:29:36.539 --> 00:29:38.819
Like I said, it's very much appeal to 10 year old me.

390
00:29:38.880 --> 00:29:40.380
This was terribly exciting.

391
00:29:40.440 --> 00:29:48.420
And as you said earlier, Mark, there is a lot of, I mean, we've mentioned a couple of alien things in the design, but like there's a lot of Star Wars in here.

392
00:29:48.480 --> 00:29:49.740
A lot.

393
00:29:49.859 --> 00:29:53.579
You know, they it starts off with a Scorpio doing the overhead show.

394
00:29:53.640 --> 00:29:55.380
I'm a huge Star Wars fan, so let me just get this out the way.

395
00:29:55.440 --> 00:30:02.039
So 1st of all, there's a huge overhead shot of a spaceship going overhead, using a giant asteroid to hide behind, you know, Empire came out the year before.

396
00:30:02.099 --> 00:30:05.759
The wipes, the use of the wipes are just so Star Wars.

397
00:30:05.819 --> 00:30:06.420
It's ridiculous.

398
00:30:06.480 --> 00:30:16.559
The shot of Scorpio going into the Xenon base, you know, left to right, going through that sort of letterbox slots exactly the same shot as a millennium falcon going into the Death Star thing.

399
00:30:16.619 --> 00:30:22.440
I mean, and just even the visual, just like being on a sandy planet with your binoculars while another alien is out, they're about to get you.

400
00:30:22.500 --> 00:30:23.880
Those are the ones I've got for now.

401
00:30:23.940 --> 00:30:24.420
Thank you very much.

402
00:30:25.019 --> 00:30:32.220
Though I did, I did notice the, like, the cheat on the, on the ship coming back to the Zenon base.

403
00:30:32.279 --> 00:30:44.279
The angles are not quite right. sort of coming towards the slot and then they cut because it's evidently going to crash into the side of the mountain just above above the opening.

404
00:30:44.339 --> 00:30:54.359
But, um, yeah, no, I, I, I, I agree with you, Conrad. it's this whole season. though is very much influenced by Star Wars.

405
00:30:54.420 --> 00:31:03.000
Um, You know, Star Wars had come out, what, sort of during the making of or the broadcast of series B?

406
00:31:03.059 --> 00:31:04.140
Yeah.

407
00:31:04.200 --> 00:31:09.480
So, It's surprised that it takes the mental series D to really be influenced by that.

408
00:31:09.720 --> 00:31:21.480
But I think they do quite a good job on a BBC budget of trying to match that sort of style and direction when they don't have, you know, emotionally controlled cameras.

409
00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:38.279
I wonder if, like, it took so long to get there because way back in series A, we talked about the fact that, you know, David Maloney had these model shots specially done to be featured across the season and the directors complained.

410
00:31:38.339 --> 00:31:46.559
I wonder if now Vera Lorimer's come along and, you know, Star Wars with Empire coming out in 1980 has proved it's not just a flash in the pan.

411
00:31:46.619 --> 00:32:00.299
People do go to the cinema to see these gorgeous effects, and I wonder if the alorimer was able to leverage that in the 18 months we've had between seasons to say, no, we are going to shoot models as their own thing.

412
00:32:00.359 --> 00:32:03.000
The Scorpio is its own character in the show.

413
00:32:03.059 --> 00:32:09.480
You know, I wonder if he really pushed for that because, yeah, we do have this element that we've had to bring back this series from the dead.

414
00:32:09.599 --> 00:32:14.400
And I think Villorimer has pushed the boat out in saying, okay, rather than just do more of the same.

415
00:32:14.880 --> 00:32:18.240
What can we do differently?

416
00:32:18.299 --> 00:32:31.500
And one of those things he does differently is it's kind of weird in that we do have this sort of flattened drab set and design going on, but at the same time, there's a uniformity to it.

417
00:32:31.559 --> 00:32:34.680
There's a style to it different to what came before.

418
00:32:34.740 --> 00:32:36.660
And in terms of this particular episode.

419
00:32:36.720 --> 00:32:39.000
Like, I can easily look at it and go, this is very slight.

420
00:32:39.059 --> 00:32:44.279
This is quite padded, but the bad Epps.

421
00:32:44.339 --> 00:32:46.799
Actually, bad is not even the right word.

422
00:32:46.859 --> 00:32:54.119
The less satisfying episode series D, don't plunge the depths of the less satisfying episodes of the 1st 3 series. for me.

423
00:32:58.019 --> 00:33:06.839
Now, whether this episode is padded or not brings me to the next thing I'd like to talk about, which is we get the crew split on 2 missions.

424
00:33:06.900 --> 00:33:10.140
Villa and Dana are sent down as bait.

425
00:33:10.319 --> 00:33:24.539
And because we are still in the part of the season where Su Lin's part is originally written for Cali, Su Lin has this big moral objection to sending them down as bait where Avon and Tarrant are like practically giggling at the idea.

426
00:33:26.339 --> 00:33:31.500
And then Avon, Sulin, and Tarrant go down for their own mission.

427
00:33:31.559 --> 00:33:47.759
And I think possibly the funniest part of this episode is Avon running into the front of a shot and standing and posing and in the in the background, Terrence looking at the tracker and standing and posing. and Su Lin's facing another direction and standing opposing and then Avon waves his arm and they run up behind him and they flank him.

428
00:33:47.819 --> 00:33:51.420
And there's just some beautiful choreography in the quarry work this week.

429
00:33:51.779 --> 00:33:53.519
Marvellous.

430
00:33:53.579 --> 00:33:54.480
Yeah.

431
00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:57.539
They wasted a whole day on that.

432
00:33:59.279 --> 00:34:04.019
What we think about splitting splitting the crew up in this way.

433
00:34:04.079 --> 00:34:16.260
I think it's a great setup, showing the ruthlessness of Avon to use people he's known for a number of years, at least, yeah.

434
00:34:16.619 --> 00:34:18.900
As an actor, at least.

435
00:34:18.960 --> 00:34:22.559
Yeah, they know each other relatively well.

436
00:34:22.619 --> 00:34:28.320
Okay, you know, they've none of them have ever really trust each other that way because there's always been that sort of weird.

437
00:34:28.380 --> 00:34:34.739
Um, dynamic, um, that's so great about Blake 7 is that they've been thrown together.

438
00:34:34.800 --> 00:34:37.800
They don't quite trust each other, but they're comrades in some way.

439
00:34:37.860 --> 00:34:46.199
Um, but it shows how ruthless he is that he's using um, Villa and Dana as bait.

440
00:34:46.260 --> 00:34:50.280
And that's great setup for his actions at the end of the episode.

441
00:34:50.400 --> 00:34:56.099
It kind of says, you know, he's willing to do this to his friends in inverted commas.

442
00:34:56.159 --> 00:35:08.639
I mean, he's going a bit too far putting the entire ship in danger at the beginning of the episode by wanting to get within 50 yards of an asteroid to try and sneak through a system.

443
00:35:08.699 --> 00:35:11.880
Um, and then he doesn't take any responsibility for that.

444
00:35:11.940 --> 00:35:21.119
He just kind of moves from one crisis to another, kind of just pushing people into situations and throwing his weight around.

445
00:35:21.119 --> 00:35:27.780
And then, um, you know, yeah, in the denim of the episode, like he does something which is just horrific.

446
00:35:28.440 --> 00:35:30.780
And we will come back to that.

447
00:35:30.840 --> 00:35:31.500
Mark?

448
00:35:31.619 --> 00:35:35.099
Yeah, I agree with this stuff about even though.

449
00:35:35.159 --> 00:35:50.340
And it reminded me a bit of Blake when the episode where Gand dies and you realise that he's just single-mindedness and the mission comes before everything and, you know, in that season, Blake had to then take stock a little bit, didn't he?

450
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:58.380
Because he'd had one of his crew killed, whereas you get a sense that Avon just isn't going to really kind of think twice about everything that's happened.

451
00:35:58.440 --> 00:36:06.179
He nearly destroyed the ship and the crew, nearly sacrificed 2 of them, and then, uh, you know, as we say, what happens at the end with Dr. Plaxton.

452
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:09.840
He's really just kind of implacable, isn't he?

453
00:36:09.900 --> 00:36:19.860
He's still such a magnetic character that you, you can't stop watching, but you realise that he's, He's not really trustworthy at all.

454
00:36:19.920 --> 00:36:30.840
You can you can see the absence of Cali in this series. especially in this episode, uh, that, yeah, Kelly was the moral centre of the show.

455
00:36:30.900 --> 00:36:40.380
Yeah, she has has principles and often is the one calling other characters out of their behaviour.

456
00:36:40.440 --> 00:36:44.639
She certainly does that to Blake and Avon throughout this, throughout the series.

457
00:36:44.639 --> 00:36:46.860
And her being gone.

458
00:36:46.920 --> 00:36:57.960
And maybe that's a conscious decision on the part of the writers, or the script debtors, saying, This is what happens. when he doesn't have a moral compass.

459
00:36:58.019 --> 00:37:01.380
And so when he doesn't have that person there, reining him in.

460
00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:04.380
Like, that's an interesting place to go with the character.

461
00:37:04.440 --> 00:37:06.059
I don't think.

462
00:37:06.659 --> 00:37:10.800
You know, like, I don't know whether you can come back from that, though.

463
00:37:11.400 --> 00:37:19.139
The Blake 7 program guy by Tony Atwood features an interview with Via Lorimer about the development of this series.

464
00:37:19.199 --> 00:37:22.139
And this is what he says about the development of Avon.

465
00:37:22.139 --> 00:37:38.940
The development of Avon's personality came through discussion of the scripts because we knew from the very start how it was going to end, and it became clear to me that we needed to make Avon gradually become hypertense, years and years of fighting, fighting, fighting with his life on the line, had produced symptoms of paranoia.

466
00:37:39.000 --> 00:37:42.420
And I think Darrow plays that really well.

467
00:37:42.480 --> 00:37:44.880
But if you don't know, that's what he's going for.

468
00:37:44.940 --> 00:37:47.460
It seems a big leap from last series.

469
00:37:47.519 --> 00:37:52.559
But after what he goes through at the end of terminal, it's entirely understandable.

470
00:37:52.619 --> 00:38:00.960
To be honest, I think with my Star Wars head-on, and also just that, this episode's got a very comic book feel.

471
00:38:01.019 --> 00:38:04.920
You know, someone, someone literally goes, talked about the gun, it goes bang, you go splat.

472
00:38:04.980 --> 00:38:12.539
Um, you know, and there was one shot on the planet, which is, you know, it's a very common shot, but it's like, they're captured by space people.

473
00:38:12.599 --> 00:38:16.199
I was like, oh, there's an identical shot in the original Buster Krab Flash Gordon.

474
00:38:16.260 --> 00:38:20.760
It's like, this is, it just, it's, so basically, I was very caught up on the in the fun of it.

475
00:38:20.820 --> 00:38:25.199
So Avon risking the, you know, the asteroid gambit.

476
00:38:25.260 --> 00:38:27.900
It's very hand solo thing to do.

477
00:38:27.960 --> 00:38:31.199
Sending Dana and Villa down to the space rats thing.

478
00:38:31.260 --> 00:38:33.119
I was just like, oh, this is going to be gorgeous.

479
00:38:33.179 --> 00:38:33.659
How fun.

480
00:38:33.719 --> 00:38:40.619
So I'm not really worried about the moral complexity of it, until, of course, the end was Dr. Plaxton when you, like this is actually quite hard to get your head around.

481
00:38:40.679 --> 00:38:45.599
Um, but the, the dynamic between them is, is, they're, they're perfect.

482
00:38:45.659 --> 00:38:57.420
That is just very simply as 2 characters, you know, someone who's terribly like brave, terribly, you know, physically agile, with a coward is just a lovely combination.

483
00:38:57.480 --> 00:38:59.760
So I just very much enjoy that contrast really.

484
00:38:59.820 --> 00:39:02.820
So, for me, it's just fairly, fairly broad.

485
00:39:02.880 --> 00:39:05.159
I'm just enjoying these characters, sort of interacting like this.

486
00:39:05.219 --> 00:39:11.340
For a 2nd, when they teleported down, they're in different places, and Villa said he was stuck.

487
00:39:11.400 --> 00:39:22.079
I thought, like, his arm was going to be in the rock, you know, like he'd, um, he'd sort of teleported, and, you know, the rock and his arm were kind of occupying the same space or something like that.

488
00:39:22.139 --> 00:39:24.360
And I thought, oh, how are they going to, how are they going to get out of that?

489
00:39:24.420 --> 00:39:35.039
That's, uh, that's a horrific thing to happen and it's, uh, but yeah, it's obviously kind of, it's just kind of a bit of comedy thing in the end, isn't it, that he's, he's stuck between the, uh, in the gap in the rock.

490
00:39:35.099 --> 00:39:40.199
But then when he fumbles his gun as well, that is that's a proper kind of funny comedy moment, I thought.

491
00:39:41.400 --> 00:39:43.199
Yeah, yeah.

492
00:39:43.260 --> 00:39:51.900
It's a nice little touch that as well because, you know, Sulin does say that the teleport's inaccurate on this ship and they have only just installed it.

493
00:39:51.960 --> 00:40:09.059
So the fact that they do come down sort of in separate locations, it goes, it goes back to way, way back to Cygnus Alpha when the 1st time Blake is sent down with the teleport, he sort of lands halfway up a slope and trips down because they haven't quite got it right yet.

494
00:40:09.119 --> 00:40:13.739
I really love Dana and Villa together.

495
00:40:13.800 --> 00:40:22.679
And I especially like when, you know, Villa, Villa is a coward, but I like it when he's also written as having some intelligence, even though he's getting stuff wrong.

496
00:40:22.739 --> 00:40:27.960
Like saying, oh, you know, I love the whole thing with, oh, no, no, no, no one's watching on that camera and you cut to the screen.

497
00:40:28.019 --> 00:40:29.940
Oh no, we're alone.

498
00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:31.440
We cut to someone with binoculars.

499
00:40:32.940 --> 00:40:37.800
It's it's kind of rocky horror-esque, really, isn't it?

500
00:40:38.099 --> 00:40:43.739
And it kind of goes back to how Barbara Shelley is playing Dr. Paxton in that.

501
00:40:43.800 --> 00:40:56.820
I think everyone's sort of seen the design for the space rats and the idea for the space rats and gone, okay, we have to play this completely seriously and reel because we have this weird fantastical element.

502
00:40:56.880 --> 00:41:04.199
And I, and yeah, I don't just mean uh, Dr. Paxton's assistant just disappearing from the plot.

503
00:41:04.260 --> 00:41:05.579
What's his name?

504
00:41:05.639 --> 00:41:06.179
Napier.

505
00:41:06.239 --> 00:41:11.340
Like Napier gets 2 or 3 lines and then as you say, Mark goes off for his lunch break.

506
00:41:11.400 --> 00:41:14.039
He just napered out for a snack.

507
00:41:15.780 --> 00:41:17.579
Don't say sorry.

508
00:41:17.820 --> 00:41:19.260
Nice.

509
00:41:19.320 --> 00:41:30.360
There is a bit where Atlam, the space rat, who isn't a space rat. does, you know, gives, gives Dr. Paxton a really sort of violent kiss and Napier looks very disgusted and disdainful.

510
00:41:30.420 --> 00:41:34.139
I think perhaps that's when he just walks off and decides not to be on this program, I think.

511
00:41:34.260 --> 00:41:36.960
He's like, oh, no, I'm not being in this.

512
00:41:37.019 --> 00:41:42.360
It was like, oh, God, it's the speed of wishing by Ben Steen and stormed offset.

513
00:41:43.800 --> 00:41:50.099
Speaking of the writing, look, I think this story is pretty well written. but there's a couple of bits of dialogue that unintentionally funny.

514
00:41:50.159 --> 00:41:51.719
Or just don't make sense.

515
00:41:51.780 --> 00:41:57.239
There's where Dana and Villa pretend to be her old students, which is amazingly great.

516
00:41:57.300 --> 00:42:04.380
It actually gives Gisette Simon a chance to do a bit of comedy, which is they'd normally give that to Villa, but it's great that they give that to Gisette Simon, who's wonderful.

517
00:42:04.440 --> 00:42:10.980
But there's a bit where Dr. Paxton says, I do not know these people, and Atlant says, do not or will not.

518
00:42:11.039 --> 00:42:15.059
And she should be like, the 1st one?

519
00:42:16.500 --> 00:42:18.840
It's supposed to be a threat, yeah.

520
00:42:18.900 --> 00:42:20.699
I will not know these people.

521
00:42:21.420 --> 00:42:24.480
It's supposed to be like, as in, you'll be dead.

522
00:42:24.780 --> 00:42:28.139
Or is it you're refusing to know that?

523
00:42:28.199 --> 00:42:31.199
Yeah, I always yeah, I always interpreted this.

524
00:42:31.260 --> 00:42:32.940
Yeah, you will not know them.

525
00:42:33.000 --> 00:42:38.699
You're choosing not to know them because you are trying to, yeah. doesn't make sense.

526
00:42:38.760 --> 00:42:39.599
Yeah.

527
00:42:39.659 --> 00:42:40.920
I will not know them.

528
00:42:41.039 --> 00:42:48.300
You know, I guess is a disconnect between the script and the direction is that in what sense are those entrances concealed?

529
00:42:48.360 --> 00:42:49.800
Yes.

530
00:42:49.800 --> 00:42:53.099
I'm not concealed.

531
00:42:53.099 --> 00:43:01.380
There's giant metal boxes, clearly sticking out of the side of a sand dune.

532
00:43:01.440 --> 00:43:10.500
Yeah, 1st there was going to be sort of a hologram or perception filter type thing where the binoculars could see through it, but they're just there, aren't they?

533
00:43:10.559 --> 00:43:12.480
It's just that you don't need the binoculars to see them.

534
00:43:12.539 --> 00:43:17.280
It seemed like maybe the idea in the script was that they would be a bit more hidden.

535
00:43:17.340 --> 00:43:22.800
Yeah, yeah, it's like concealed, concealed doorway and the designer's just gone, oh, doorway.

536
00:43:22.860 --> 00:43:23.340
Okay, got you.

537
00:43:23.400 --> 00:43:24.059
Yep, all right.

538
00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:47.760
Speaking of concealed, maybe this is the planet of the concealed doorway because, like, maybe like, doors are invisible to people, because when they, when Avon and the gang are making a huge, great, big mammoth hole in the wall with so much noise, like a construction site, there's smud smoke, there's a light and it's literally right behind him and he's like, oh, where did you come from?

539
00:43:47.820 --> 00:43:49.260
Like, dude.

540
00:43:49.320 --> 00:43:50.579
Dude.

541
00:43:57.360 --> 00:44:11.820
On that note, I think we can talk about the ending, which is one of the most sort of quoted moments of this series, and that is Dr. Paxton's, I hesitate to use the word sacrifice.

542
00:44:11.880 --> 00:44:14.340
Dr. Plexen is sacrificed.

543
00:44:14.400 --> 00:44:15.119
Yes, yes.

544
00:44:15.179 --> 00:44:22.980
Wow, it's, it's kind of this weird thing in that, you know, the initial conception for the season is, okay, we've got a ship.

545
00:44:23.039 --> 00:44:23.760
We've got a base.

546
00:44:23.820 --> 00:44:33.239
We can accumulate scientists and allies, accept with the way BBC contracts work, we can't know that they're going to be around in 3 months to film a scene for the finale.

547
00:44:33.300 --> 00:44:35.400
So we'll just kill them.

548
00:44:35.820 --> 00:44:40.920
Or render them somehow, you know, unavailable.

549
00:44:40.980 --> 00:44:50.219
And yeah, so we, we, we do get this incredible, these incredible scenes at the end, but wow.

550
00:44:50.280 --> 00:44:52.320
Mark, you watch this for the 1st time.

551
00:44:52.380 --> 00:44:54.539
So what was your big reaction here?

552
00:44:54.719 --> 00:44:57.599
Yeah, I thought it was it was brutal.

553
00:44:57.659 --> 00:44:58.800
Absolutely.

554
00:44:58.860 --> 00:45:06.539
And I think, you know, as I said, before building what Avon had done earlier in this story, I do think, as James said, it sets that up really nicely.

555
00:45:06.599 --> 00:45:09.420
Um, yeah, it was it was surprising.

556
00:45:09.480 --> 00:45:15.420
I think whenever anybody comes on board the ship, I'm kind of thinking, are they going to join because they're not at 7 at the moment.

557
00:45:15.480 --> 00:45:20.280
So I'm always kind of wondering whether they're going to hit the sort of crew of seven.

558
00:45:20.340 --> 00:45:23.880
I suppose if you count the 2 computers, there's 7 people, isn't it?

559
00:45:23.940 --> 00:45:25.860
I think that's what that's what you have.

560
00:45:25.980 --> 00:45:26.519
Right.

561
00:45:26.519 --> 00:45:26.699
Yeah.

562
00:45:26.760 --> 00:45:27.119
Okay.

563
00:45:27.179 --> 00:45:28.559
I wasn't I wasn't thinking about that.

564
00:45:28.619 --> 00:45:32.159
I was thinking maybe they're going to have a kind of an engineer kind of character.

565
00:45:32.219 --> 00:45:42.360
Because it seems like they're kind of building back towards what they had, so they're having the fastest ship, the teleports and all the kind of stuff that's going to allow them to kind of run rings around the Federation a little bit.

566
00:45:42.420 --> 00:45:47.400
So yeah, I, for me, it was, it was plausible that she was going to join because it's kind of early enough in the season.

567
00:45:47.460 --> 00:45:50.579
But yeah, it was, it was very shocking.

568
00:45:50.639 --> 00:45:55.320
The way it's directed, the way her dying scream is then overlaid with the ship escaping.

569
00:45:55.380 --> 00:45:57.420
So you've got sort of moment of triumph.

570
00:45:57.480 --> 00:46:03.179
Uh, for the crew, but with, with her, let's say, sacrifice.

571
00:46:03.239 --> 00:46:05.820
It was very effectively directed.

572
00:46:05.880 --> 00:46:07.800
I think it did hit home like that.

573
00:46:07.800 --> 00:46:08.880
And then they don't dwell on it.

574
00:46:08.940 --> 00:46:10.320
You just get Avon saying, who?

575
00:46:10.500 --> 00:46:20.340
And then they go, so presumably, and I guess probably Villa is going to get the job of dragging a corpse out of there and disposing of it if she wasn't vaporised.

576
00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:22.440
They missed a trick there, though.

577
00:46:22.500 --> 00:46:24.539
They could have, they could have been.

578
00:46:24.599 --> 00:46:25.800
But what about the doctor?

579
00:46:25.860 --> 00:46:26.699
Who?

580
00:46:26.820 --> 00:46:28.260
Yes.

581
00:46:28.440 --> 00:46:31.380
Allegedly in the original script.

582
00:46:31.440 --> 00:46:35.519
It's, what about Dr. Paxton, Doctor Who?

583
00:46:35.639 --> 00:46:39.059
and apparently Paul Darrow said that's a bit on the nose.

584
00:46:39.659 --> 00:46:43.019
And also, I'm not having anything to do with dog too.

585
00:46:43.079 --> 00:46:45.599
I never, I never did. will never appear on Doctor Who.

586
00:46:45.659 --> 00:46:49.980
It was, it's quite, it's interesting what happens at the end.

587
00:46:50.039 --> 00:46:51.119
There's a couple of things.

588
00:46:51.179 --> 00:46:58.920
Well, 1st of all, this is another one of these dialogue things that just tickled me, whereas they're like, you've got to, she goes, I can install this drive now and we can escape these, you know, these ships.

589
00:46:58.980 --> 00:47:02.039
And and then it's just like, she's like, how long will it take?

590
00:47:02.099 --> 00:47:03.059
And she goes, 50 minutes.

591
00:47:03.119 --> 00:47:04.679
I was like, well, that's way too long.

592
00:47:04.739 --> 00:47:05.820
They're clearly on our tails.

593
00:47:05.880 --> 00:47:06.900
But like it's very specific.

594
00:47:06.960 --> 00:47:07.619
It's 50 minutes.

595
00:47:07.679 --> 00:47:10.679
And then Dana goes, make it 45. what?

596
00:47:10.739 --> 00:47:19.619
It's very specific. like normally when you sort of, you know, Davros or Darth Vader has to ratch up the time, the tension, I said, you've got to do it in half the time, double your efforts.

597
00:47:19.679 --> 00:47:21.900
But it's like, I'll do it in 50, do it in 45.

598
00:47:22.079 --> 00:47:30.780
I'm like, it just seems so odd because it's because it's quite a long, like it should be, you know, a bit more tension would be like, oh, it'll take me 10 minutes. like, you've got three.

599
00:47:30.900 --> 00:47:32.579
You know, just that's like, oh, God.

600
00:47:32.639 --> 00:47:34.559
But it's quite a long time.

601
00:47:34.619 --> 00:47:37.500
And there's some odd direction bits going on.

602
00:47:37.500 --> 00:47:43.079
Because it was so interesting because there was a sense where I was like, she knows she's going to cop it.

603
00:47:43.139 --> 00:47:52.559
Maybe there was a moment where she sort of goes a bit slowly putting together some of those leads because I was like, you're in a hurry and there's a moment where she's a bit pensive and she's kind of slowly putting together these leads.

604
00:47:52.619 --> 00:47:53.880
I was like, does she know?

605
00:47:53.940 --> 00:47:56.760
And then clearly, clearly she doesn't.

606
00:47:56.820 --> 00:48:00.300
And also I was a bit confused because I was like, what can she see after that?

607
00:48:00.360 --> 00:48:02.039
I still a bit unsure about the geography of this?

608
00:48:02.099 --> 00:48:09.179
And obviously we've seen, um, we saw Tarrant and Avon sort of, uh, fix the ship with a big hole in the wall.

609
00:48:09.179 --> 00:48:12.780
And then it's like, what, can she sort of see the ships behind her?

610
00:48:12.900 --> 00:48:15.659
I wondered if perhaps she was breaking the force wall?

611
00:48:15.719 --> 00:48:16.500
I'm really sorry.

612
00:48:18.059 --> 00:48:19.860
I had to get that.

613
00:48:19.980 --> 00:48:23.159
I just thought, Mark might say that, so I'm just going to find that.

614
00:48:23.219 --> 00:48:25.079
It's a little confusing.

615
00:48:25.139 --> 00:48:26.760
And then it is odd.

616
00:48:26.820 --> 00:48:29.099
And then everyone just sort of saying, who?

617
00:48:29.099 --> 00:48:31.739
And you're like, oh, wow, you really just let her do that.

618
00:48:31.800 --> 00:48:33.840
It's it's, it doesn't quite work.

619
00:48:34.019 --> 00:48:37.619
Yeah, look, I think either she's playing it that way.

620
00:48:37.679 --> 00:48:45.000
I mean, I got the impression on the 1st time I watched this many years ago, I kind of went, why is she going so slowly?

621
00:48:45.059 --> 00:48:46.320
Why does she keep looking up?

622
00:48:46.380 --> 00:48:50.280
Why is she's being so hesitant about making these final connections?

623
00:48:50.340 --> 00:48:58.380
I always read it as, she, she knows there's not enough time and she, like she's a scientist.

624
00:48:58.440 --> 00:49:00.840
She's worked out that there's not enough time.

625
00:49:00.900 --> 00:49:05.579
And the only way they are going to escape is if they've already switched the drive on.

626
00:49:05.820 --> 00:49:10.619
I don't think it quite lands, but maybe that's...

627
00:49:10.679 --> 00:49:11.639
It's being directed.

628
00:49:11.699 --> 00:49:18.719
Yeah, and I think I think also it's directed that when Avon makes his decision. he cuts off the communication to her.

629
00:49:18.780 --> 00:49:26.340
Like, he's halfway through giving her a time call and then press the button and that's when he explains what he's doing.

630
00:49:26.400 --> 00:49:35.940
And I do wonder if maybe after he's cut off the communication, if she'd looked up and said, There's not enough time, you're going to have to activate as soon as I put this together.

631
00:49:36.000 --> 00:49:40.320
So if she had figured it out and realised she needed to sacrifice herself.

632
00:49:40.380 --> 00:49:42.179
But Avon doesn't know she figured it out.

633
00:49:42.239 --> 00:49:44.820
So he's still doing the bastard thing.

634
00:49:44.880 --> 00:49:46.920
But for us as the audience.

635
00:49:46.980 --> 00:49:48.000
Oh, it's okay.

636
00:49:48.059 --> 00:49:49.260
She's figured it out.

637
00:49:49.320 --> 00:49:53.940
And, you know, she's sticking one in the eye to the Federation because she's helping Avon.

638
00:49:54.059 --> 00:49:56.340
She sticking one in the eye to the space rats because she's free.

639
00:49:56.400 --> 00:50:03.239
But yeah, it is strange and it's kind of like, you know, the engines at the back are open to space, but even I was confused because I'm like, they repaired that wall earlier.

640
00:50:03.300 --> 00:50:07.139
It's like, oh, no, this is this is the other wall that's open to space.

641
00:50:07.199 --> 00:50:09.179
So why bother repairing that one?

642
00:50:10.800 --> 00:50:14.880
Yeah, why are you preparing the whole, the hull?

643
00:50:14.940 --> 00:50:26.579
Yeah, like, I mean, I think it's getting back to that point that we were making earlier about the way that the ship is filmed and we don't yet know how the ship's laid out.

644
00:50:26.699 --> 00:50:34.559
Um, it's not quite clear that what she's doing is in the same room that they were in earlier.

645
00:50:34.739 --> 00:50:44.579
The repair to the hole is nowhere near the engine, that breach in the hull is kind of 2 thirds of the way along.

646
00:50:45.179 --> 00:50:45.840
How big is this ship?

647
00:50:47.219 --> 00:50:49.079
Like we can't really tell.

648
00:50:49.139 --> 00:50:57.119
And so if she's looking out the back over the jets for want of a better word at the back of the ship.

649
00:50:57.179 --> 00:50:58.139
Where is she?

650
00:50:58.199 --> 00:51:01.920
Is it a tiny, tiny, tiny ship, but we just don't realise that yet?

651
00:51:01.980 --> 00:51:03.780
Like, how big is it?

652
00:51:03.840 --> 00:51:08.400
And when Mark said earlier, there were front face, there were screens at the front.

653
00:51:08.460 --> 00:51:12.480
I actually don't, I kind of couldn't remember that because I just, I was just obsessed with these ones at the back.

654
00:51:12.539 --> 00:51:14.639
I was like, why are these screens behind them?

655
00:51:14.699 --> 00:51:16.139
I don't know what's going on.

656
00:51:16.199 --> 00:51:18.059
Yeah, look out the rear window.

657
00:51:18.119 --> 00:51:19.260
Oh, right.

658
00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:20.039
Okay, good.

659
00:51:20.099 --> 00:51:21.840
So they can see who they're blasting out of the back.

660
00:51:21.900 --> 00:51:23.519
I don't know what's going on with that.

661
00:51:23.639 --> 00:51:27.000
If you could have just seen this little doll floating away.

662
00:51:27.059 --> 00:51:32.219
Yeah, it's interesting that a show made multi-camera.

663
00:51:32.699 --> 00:51:39.480
The directors and writers then have the thought that you need to have a screen facing in the direction of the camera.

664
00:51:39.539 --> 00:51:45.300
So instead of just having a camera on the front, a camera on the back, linked to the same screen, like we actually make this show on.

665
00:51:45.360 --> 00:51:49.860
No, in 700 years time, we're going to need one screen per camera.

666
00:51:51.900 --> 00:52:05.760
But something I only just realised is, I think, the gun Tarrant uses to burn through the wall is intended to be the same thing that Avon repairs the hull with at the beginning.

667
00:52:05.880 --> 00:52:11.400
So it's, it's, it's like a make or repair hole in wall gun.

668
00:52:11.519 --> 00:52:15.599
Chekhov's make or repair.

669
00:52:25.320 --> 00:52:28.199
Is there anything else anyone wanted to mention?

670
00:52:28.260 --> 00:52:29.099
Actually, I do.

671
00:52:29.159 --> 00:52:39.300
I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I have to, this is a flight through entirety family podcast, therefore, I am contractually obliged to tell some peripheral Zedless showbiz story.

672
00:52:39.360 --> 00:52:41.280
And I um, so I have two.

673
00:52:41.340 --> 00:52:49.619
I worked with Michael Keating on an audio, uh, doctor audio, uh, and that was just, I, was wonderful.

674
00:52:49.679 --> 00:52:55.739
He was obviously very, very lovely, but one of the nicest things about working with him is there was, I vividly remember a moment.

675
00:52:55.800 --> 00:52:58.559
Where that was so villa like.

676
00:52:58.619 --> 00:53:00.360
It really just slapped me around the chops.

677
00:53:00.420 --> 00:53:12.360
He was talking about his wife, and he said his wife had been ill, and he goes, oh yes, she's got schizophrenia, and then he just looked off to the distance rather wistfully and raised his eyebrows and said, but then you're never alone with schizophrenia.

678
00:53:12.420 --> 00:53:14.219
And I thought, oh my god, you're villa.

679
00:53:14.280 --> 00:53:15.719
Oh my god, it's actually.

680
00:53:16.320 --> 00:53:18.360
So that was rather lovely.

681
00:53:18.420 --> 00:53:20.820
And that's unbelievable.

682
00:53:20.880 --> 00:53:22.619
As if life couldn't get any more exciting.

683
00:53:22.679 --> 00:53:24.000
A couple of years later, this is mad.

684
00:53:24.059 --> 00:53:26.820
I was going to say Paul Darrow played my dad.

685
00:53:26.880 --> 00:53:29.099
I played Paul Darrow's son in an audio.

686
00:53:29.159 --> 00:53:32.400
So they cast Paul Darrow as my father in an audio.

687
00:53:32.460 --> 00:53:34.139
Now this is insanity.

688
00:53:34.199 --> 00:53:39.360
He turned upon the day and the director, Gary said, said, oh, Paul, this is Conrad.

689
00:53:39.480 --> 00:53:40.139
He's playing your son.

690
00:53:40.199 --> 00:53:43.320
And he looked me up and down and said, he's too old to be my son.

691
00:53:43.320 --> 00:53:45.719
And I was like, 0 shit, we are in for.

692
00:53:45.780 --> 00:53:48.360
We are in for one of the worst days of my life.

693
00:53:48.420 --> 00:53:50.400
I'm about to get torn apart by Avon.

694
00:53:50.460 --> 00:53:51.059
So I thought, okay.

695
00:53:51.119 --> 00:53:53.880
But for some reason they did photo, you know, they do photos for publicity.

696
00:53:53.880 --> 00:53:55.079
And I said, right, we're going to do it before.

697
00:53:55.199 --> 00:53:56.519
We're going to do the before the recording.

698
00:53:56.579 --> 00:54:03.480
So, like, instantly I'm going, like, walking to have my photograph taping with Paul Darrow, and I'm sort of vibrating with the excitement, but very, quite scared.

699
00:54:03.539 --> 00:54:07.980
So I just sort of said to him, like, Paul, I'm just going to say, absolutely love you, Blake Seven.

700
00:54:08.039 --> 00:54:11.280
And I'm literally walking down a corridor with it, but I said, I've got to get this out.

701
00:54:11.340 --> 00:54:12.539
So I said, I really love you.

702
00:54:12.599 --> 00:54:13.619
You amazing, Blake 7.

703
00:54:13.679 --> 00:54:15.840
And I was like, and my mum, because I act, this is true.

704
00:54:15.900 --> 00:54:18.000
I told my mum I was working with Paul Darrow.

705
00:54:18.059 --> 00:54:22.320
And her response, thank you, Jennifer West, was, oh, we can put his slippers under my bed any day.

706
00:54:22.380 --> 00:54:28.440
Um, like mother-like son.

707
00:54:28.500 --> 00:54:29.760
So I told him this.

708
00:54:29.820 --> 00:54:32.159
I told him this and I was like, I'm really risking it.

709
00:54:32.219 --> 00:54:32.880
I'm babbling.

710
00:54:32.940 --> 00:54:33.780
I love you, Blake.

711
00:54:33.840 --> 00:54:36.780
By the way, I told my mum this morning, and she said, did you put her slippers under her bed any day?

712
00:54:36.780 --> 00:54:38.340
And he went, ha, ha, ha.

713
00:54:38.340 --> 00:54:39.599
Send her my love.

714
00:54:39.659 --> 00:54:43.559
And I was like, oh, there he is.

715
00:54:43.619 --> 00:54:46.619
There he is, smooth as.

716
00:54:47.340 --> 00:54:52.860
He was obviously delightful to work with his voice in my ear all day.

717
00:54:52.920 --> 00:54:54.420
I just can't even say that.

718
00:54:54.480 --> 00:54:57.000
I think I've even got a photograph of me, me and him back to back.

719
00:54:57.059 --> 00:54:59.880
So that's just, I had to blow that out as my peripheral story.

720
00:54:59.940 --> 00:55:03.719
The only last thing I want to say on a much more mundane note, is that I've done it.

721
00:55:03.780 --> 00:55:06.719
I found a piece of research and it's a Blake 7 fact.

722
00:55:06.719 --> 00:55:11.400
And I, I, I, I was trying to find out where this, the, this, this, the location was.

723
00:55:11.400 --> 00:55:15.360
And it's in, a quarry in Dunstable, and I was like, I bet it's a Doctor Who one.

724
00:55:15.420 --> 00:55:19.500
They did film tear of the autons and macraterra in some quarries.

725
00:55:19.559 --> 00:55:20.099
Not quite sure.

726
00:55:20.159 --> 00:55:24.420
But basically on every Blake 7 wiki site, it says unknown quarry.

727
00:55:24.480 --> 00:55:29.460
And in Gumi, I found the quarry, it's Kensworth chalk pit.

728
00:55:29.519 --> 00:55:37.440
So any real Blake 7 fans, please update Blake 7 wiki that this film was filmed at Kensworth chalk pit.

729
00:55:37.500 --> 00:55:38.219
Thank you.

730
00:55:44.280 --> 00:55:50.099
Well, as we jet off to the stars and try and ignore the screams coming out the back, that's all the time we have for this week.

731
00:55:50.159 --> 00:55:57.539
Come back next week when the production team desperately wants us not to remember Dana's age or how to do basic maths in animals.

732
00:55:57.599 --> 00:55:59.519
Conrad, where can people find you?

733
00:55:59.820 --> 00:56:04.199
Sorry, I'm still slightly stunned, stunned by the content.

734
00:56:04.260 --> 00:56:08.460
You can find me on Twitter at Head of the Hound underscore or at Kensworth Chalk Pit.

735
00:56:09.840 --> 00:56:13.019
Loitering behind the concealed entrance.

736
00:56:13.920 --> 00:56:19.139
Sorry, that was that came out a lot a lot ruder than I thought.

737
00:56:19.139 --> 00:56:20.460
Find James in jail.

738
00:56:22.139 --> 00:56:23.820
Oh, dear.

739
00:56:23.940 --> 00:56:28.559
Until next time, no matter what the man says, Alton Towers is not named after him.

740
00:56:28.619 --> 00:56:30.719
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

741
00:56:30.780 --> 00:56:31.500
Good night.

742
00:56:31.559 --> 00:56:32.699
Ta-ta.

743
00:56:32.760 --> 00:56:33.599
Who?

744
00:56:34.559 --> 00:56:38.099
Oh, I can tell you.

745
00:56:38.219 --> 00:56:39.300
That was your fat.

746
00:56:39.360 --> 00:56:42.599
That took me right back to a studio in Barrow, you've got the job.

747
00:56:42.659 --> 00:56:43.019
My God.

748
00:56:43.079 --> 00:56:44.340
Back to my power.

749
00:56:44.400 --> 00:56:49.260
Go, go. 30 seconds rush to the maximum power.

750
00:56:49.380 --> 00:56:51.300
Switching to my animal.

751
00:56:51.360 --> 00:56:53.519
Maximum power on all drives.

752
00:56:53.880 --> 00:56:56.039
Maximal power.

753
00:56:57.599 --> 00:57:06.119
Actually, speaking of that, I watched this with Rod halfway through the Avon and Tarrant repairing the whole scene.

754
00:57:06.179 --> 00:57:09.000
He's like, You can see which way he's dressed.

755
00:57:09.179 --> 00:57:13.019
So if you want to go back and look at Stephen Pacey.

756
00:57:13.079 --> 00:57:15.059
Those are some tight trousers he's wearing.

757
00:57:16.500 --> 00:57:18.420
Being in that.

758
00:57:18.480 --> 00:57:24.539
He was like, oh, God, this has been, we shouldn't buy John Steed.

759
00:57:25.139 --> 00:57:26.940
John Steed?

760
00:57:27.000 --> 00:57:27.659
Oh, God.

761
00:57:30.960 --> 00:57:32.820
Shall I say that again?

762
00:57:32.880 --> 00:57:33.840
Yes, go ahead.

763
00:57:33.900 --> 00:57:36.059
I got a blank to his name now.

764
00:57:36.119 --> 00:57:37.679
Ben Steed, thank you.

765
00:57:37.800 --> 00:57:44.880
I think it goes back to the conversation we were having earlier about the way the shit...

766
00:57:45.179 --> 00:57:45.480
Wow.

767
00:57:45.539 --> 00:57:47.699
It's orange.

768
00:57:47.760 --> 00:57:49.440
It's not brown. it's orange.

769
00:57:49.500 --> 00:57:50.820
Decentery orange.